Numbers Attack Tournament - Round 5

Charlie Reams · Post by **Charlie Reams** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 12:20 am

Pairings for the 5th and final round

So this week sees the final games, and in particular the Grand Finals: Innis Carson vs Nick Wainwright in Div A, and Matt Morrison vs James Hall in Div B. Hopefully the participants of these monster games will let us know when they plan to play so that we mere mortals can tune in.

Good luck to everyone else and thanks for playing. Please complete your games by next Sunday.

Round 4 adjudications (winners starred)
Simmonds* vs Hulme
Lee vs Reynolds*
Juachan* vs White
Murphy vs Russell*
Gillies* vs Burgin

Darren Carter · Post by **Darren Carter** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 1:09 am

Are we then going to have the winners of those two matches playing to see who is the overall winner?

Charlie Reams · Post by **Charlie Reams** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 1:22 am

Darren Carter wrote:Are we then going to have the winners of those two matches playing to see who is the overall winner?

I don't think so, it would be like the winner of the Premiership playing the winner of the Championship.

Jimmy Gough · Post by **Jimmy Gough** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 1:53 am

Or the winner of the Champions League playing the winner of the UEFA Cup

Kai Laddiman · Post by **Kai Laddiman** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 9:32 am

Jimmy Gough wrote:Or the winner of the Champions League playing the winner of the UEFA Cup

What's the UEFA Cup?

Howard Somerset · Post by **Howard Somerset** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 9:38 am

Kai Laddiman wrote:
Jimmy Gough wrote:Or the winner of the Champions League playing the winner of the UEFA Cup
What's the UEFA Cup?

I'm still trying to get used to the fact that it's not called the Inter-Cities Fairs Cup any more.

James Robinson · Post by **James Robinson** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 9:58 am

Howard Somerset wrote:
Kai Laddiman wrote:
Jimmy Gough wrote:Or the winner of the Champions League playing the winner of the UEFA Cup
What's the UEFA Cup?
I'm still trying to get used to the fact that it's not called the Inter-Cities Fairs Cup any more.

Of course, it's not either nowadays, it's the Europa League.

Darren Carter · Post by **Darren Carter** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:27 am

Charlie Reams wrote:
Darren Carter wrote:Are we then going to have the winners of those two matches playing to see who is the overall winner?
I don't think so, it would be like the winner of the Premiership playing the winner of the Championship.

I did think that, but as it was purely numbers I thought it might be quite close. Obviously if it was a 15-rounder it would be a ridiculous idea.

Matthew Green · Post by **Matthew Green** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 11:18 am

James Robinson wrote:Of course, it's not either nowadays, it's the Europa League.

Surely the word 'neither' exists so we don't need to use the phrase 'not either'?

Alec Rivers · Post by **Alec Rivers** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 2:31 pm

Matthew Green wrote:
James Robinson wrote:Of course, it's not either nowadays, it's the Europa League.

Surely the word 'neither' exists so we don't need to use the phrase 'not either'?

Useful for a subtle difference in emphasis, perhaps?

Shaun Hegarty · Post by **Shaun Hegarty** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 3:05 pm

Kieran Child 127 - 151 Shaun Hegarty

Tournament thingy didn't show up so we played a normal game.

Gavin Chipper · Post by **Gavin Chipper** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 6:01 pm

Darren Carter wrote:
Charlie Reams wrote:
Darren Carter wrote:Are we then going to have the winners of those two matches playing to see who is the overall winner?
I don't think so, it would be like the winner of the Premiership playing the winner of the Championship.
I did think that, but as it was purely numbers I thought it might be quite close. Obviously if it was a 15-rounder it would be a ridiculous idea.

Well exactly. Most people's ratings are overwhelmingly biased towards their letters skills so Charlie's point doesn't hold at all. I think it would be very interesting to see the two play against each other, even if it isn't "official".

Ian Volante · Post by **Ian Volante** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 6:37 pm

When is Mr Stitcher usually around?

Charlie Reams · Post by **Charlie Reams** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 7:03 pm

Gavin Chipper wrote:Well exactly. Most people's ratings are overwhelmingly biased towards their letters skills so Charlie's point doesn't hold at all.

So you think it's entirely fair that someone who has beaten 5 players rated 600 - 1080 would be judged the overall winner for a single victory over someone who has beaten 5 players rated 1100 - 1900?

Gavin Chipper · Post by **Gavin Chipper** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:24 pm

Charlie Reams wrote:
Gavin Chipper wrote:Well exactly. Most people's ratings are overwhelmingly biased towards their letters skills so Charlie's point doesn't hold at all.
So you think it's entirely fair that someone who has beaten 5 players rated 600 - 1080 would be judged the overall winner for a single victory over someone who has beaten 5 players rated 1100 - 1900?

No - I think they should play against each other though. And doesn't the Swiss pairs system favour the weaker players in a way anyway? It seems the top two ranked players go against each other each time, so in the final, one of the players has been playing "finals" all the way. So it wouldn't be too far removed from that.

Actually -

- I didn't really pay attention the "to see who is the overall winner" bit in the original post. But I still think you dismissed the first post too easily.

Charlie Reams · Post by **Charlie Reams** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:35 pm

I'm not averse to them playing each other, they can do what they like, I just think it'd be a weird way to decide an overall winner. Maybe if I run another NAT at some point (likely), I'll operate a kind of promotion/relegation scheme, or something.

Gavin Chipper · Post by **Gavin Chipper** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:42 pm

Charlie Reams wrote:Maybe if I run another NAT at some point (likely), I'll operate a kind of promotion/relegation scheme, or something.

Sounds good.

peter lee · Post by **peter lee** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:13 pm

Peter Lee 143 Ian Dent 117

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?game=132675

Julie T · Post by **Julie T** » Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:26 pm

Shaun Hegarty wrote:Kieran Child 127 - 151 Shaun Hegarty

Tournament thingy didn't show up so we played a normal game.

Maybe this is something to with the fact that my last week's draw game came up today.
Perhaps something needs resetting, Charlie.

Julie T · Post by **Julie T** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:20 pm

Gregor Morgan 107 - 156 Julie Taylor

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?game=133123

Gregor had a shaky start, but made quite a good comeback, as he played well in the second half.

James Robinson · Post by **James Robinson** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 10:22 pm

Jim Bentley 177 - 151 James Robinson
Very good game by Jim. Yet again, more stupid errors by me cost me a realistic chance of winning the game. But, Jim was the deserving winner.

Richard Priest · Post by **Richard Priest** » Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:18 pm

Like Karen Pearson a couple of weeks ago - I am struggling to find Reuben Kay to arrange our game.Any suggestions anyone?

JackHurst · Post by **JackHurst** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 5:58 pm

Jack Hurst 175-160 Dinos Sfyris

It was a close game, a battle of 4 large vs 6 small, with me coming out on top due to a couple of unfortunate misclicks by Dinos. Well played Dinos, hard luck with the misclicks.

Ian Volante · Post by **Ian Volante** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 6:33 pm

In the wooden spoon play-off:

Ian V 158, Jon S 144

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?game=133435

Hugh Binnie · Post by **Hugh Binnie** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 9:56 pm

Slightly confused: the draw says I should play Andrew Herbertson, who duly beat me; but a tournament match instead came up against Andrew Feist, whom I beat.

Andrew Herbertson · Post by **Andrew Herbertson** » Wed Oct 28, 2009 10:00 pm

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?game=133554

Andrew Herbertson 132-124 Hugh Binnie

As Hugh says he had already played a game that came up in tournament mode so don't know what happend there. Anyway good close game nip and tuck all the way.

Andrew Feist · Post by **Andrew Feist** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 7:29 am

Hugh Binnie wrote:Slightly confused: the draw says I should play Andrew Herbertson, who duly beat me; but a tournament match instead came up against Andrew Feist, whom I beat.

Indeed. When the blue thing came up, I just thought I had forgotten the draw. But that was not the case....

Dinos Sfyris · Post by **Dinos Sfyris** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:08 am

JackHurst wrote:Jack Hurst 175-160 Dinos Sfyris

It was a close game, a battle of 4 large vs 6 small, with me coming out on top due to a couple of unfortunate misclicks by Dinos. Well played Dinos, hard luck with the misclicks.

This game was disappointingly void of sexual innuendo, except for Jack's brother was in the room while we did it.

Phil Makepeace · Post by **Phil Makepeace** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 1:40 pm

Group A:

Phil Makepeace 184 - 141 Henry Meier

Innis Carson · Post by **Innis Carson** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 8:29 pm

Division A:

Innis 137 - 129 Nick

A decent game, Nick made a few slips at the beginning but was close to pulling it back towards the end with good 6 small play. Could have very easily gone the other way I think. Cheers Nick, and cheers Charlie as well for running the tournament.

Nick Wainwright · Post by **Nick Wainwright** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 8:42 pm

Innis Carson wrote:Division A:

Innis 137 - 129 Nick

A decent game, Nick made a few slips at the beginning but was close to pulling it back towards the end with good 6 small play. Could have very easily gone the other way I think. Cheers Nick, and cheers Charlie as well for running the tournament.

Well played Innis. After my disasterous first half I was content in the end to maintain a positive points difference for the tournament as a whole. Thanks too to Charlie for another well run tournament, as always.

Gavin Chipper · Post by **Gavin Chipper** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 9:18 pm

Clive Brooker 167 - 187 Gevin Chapwell

Our final round game. Clive misclicked once which would have made it a lot closer. Several flat rounds meant that Clive didn't have much to work with to catch up. I was worried he might start doing 4 large but he stuck with his 2 large. I'm quite pleased with 18 maxes and a 4-1 win record to go away with.

Also, it will be interesting to see where this puts me, as I don't think my "goal difference" is as good as some of the other players.

Clive Brooker · Post by **Clive Brooker** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 9:42 pm

Gavin Chipper wrote:Clive Brooker 167 - 187 Gevin Chapwell

Our final round game. Clive misclicked once which would have made it a lot closer. Several flat rounds meant that Clive didn't have much to work with to catch up. I was worried he might start doing 4 large but he stuck with his 2 large. I'm quite pleased with 18 maxes and a 4-1 win record to go away with.

Also, it will be interesting to see where this puts me, as I don't think my "goal difference" is as good as some of the other players.

I think 3rd place was faintly possible if one of us had run away with it.

I conceded 2 rounds early on which I should have got easily, so Gevin didn't have to switch to 6 small to try to get an advantage. Thereafter we had a very quiet game with Gevin barely faltering until the game was decided.

Gevin, I'm sure I remember you saying once that you hate 2 large, so I was never going to pick anything else!

If anyone's interested, I'm working on an analysis of this tournament taking into account William Tunstall-Pedoe's ratings for individual rounds, rather similar to the Rachel v Carol analysis I did a while back. I did think about flagging this earlier to give an incentive to players who lost narrowly in an early round, but I didn't want to promise something I wan't sure I'd be able to do.

Thanks to Charlie and congratulations to Innis.

Matthew Tassier · Post by **Matthew Tassier** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 9:52 pm

Div B: Niall Seymour 90 - 178 Matthew Tassier

Niall miscalculated in a couple of the early rounds, which seemed to put him off rather for a while. This did allow me to post a good goal difference in the battle for second place.

Michael Wallace · Post by **Michael Wallace** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 9:57 pm

Oliver Garner 161 - 133 Michael Wallace

I was a bit poo.

Howard Somerset · Post by **Howard Somerset** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:29 pm

I've also got a mis-match with my round 5 fixture. The pairings match me with Scott Gillies, yet the auto-tournament system is trying to give me a tournament game with Gareth Mitchell, who I played in round 4.

I'll play Scott when we can both get online together, and get the result posted here.

Michael Wallace · Post by **Michael Wallace** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:40 pm

Howard Somerset wrote:I've also got a mis-match with my round 5 fixture. The pairings match me with Scott Gillies, yet the auto-tournament system is trying to give me a tournament game with Gareth Mitchell, who I played in round 4.

Yeah - this happened with me too (that is, with my 4th round opponent, rather than Gareth Mitchell).

I think the only reasonable conclusion is that Charlie is rubbish.

Charlie Reams · Post by **Charlie Reams** » Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:56 pm

Yeah it looks like I entered the wrong fixtures into the tournament matchifier. Apologies to anyone who was puzzled by this.

Howard Somerset · Post by **Howard Somerset** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 12:07 am

Scott 155 - 148 Howard

Would've gone to a tie-break if I'd not forgotten to declare on one round. I think I'm glad I did forget, cos there's no way I wanted a conundrum.

Phil Reynolds · Post by **Phil Reynolds** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 3:44 pm

I completely barfed this Div B game against Josh and he played extremely well, capitalising on virtually every mistake I made.

Josh Overhill 161 - 107 Phil Reynolds

My final tourney tally stands at: won 0, lost 3, had two games awarded to me by default. I'm shit.

Kirk Bevins · Post by **Kirk Bevins** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 6:03 pm

Is the automatic tournament thing not working? It still comes up with a tournament game between me and Reuben even though we've played ours. It should come up with a game between me and Jimmy but it doesn't.

Richard Priest · Post by **Richard Priest** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 6:51 pm

Reuben Kay 191-150 Richard Priest

John Gillies · Post by **John Gillies** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 7:37 pm

Just played Supee
Result 143 - 124 to me
going to paste URL thingy- but don't really know what i'm doing
Here goes

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?ke ... 3570565400

erm - is that correct? Doesn't look like other results posted.
I'm too old for computers.

Hope this is ok, Charlie.

Howard Somerset · Post by **Howard Somerset** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 7:41 pm

Phil Reynolds wrote:My final tourney tally stands at: won 0, lost 3, had two games awarded to me by default. I'm shit.

If only we'd been drawn against each other, Phil, then one of us would have had a non-default win. Next time, maybe.

Stuart Arnot · Post by **Stuart Arnot** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:24 pm

No tourney box, so here's the result:

Lee Simmonds 137 - 180 Stuart Arnot

Glad to finish the tournament with a win. More please!!

Gareth Mitchell · Post by **Gareth Mitchell** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:37 pm

Sent PM to James Levison about our Round 5 game, on Tuesday, still in my outbox. Also sent email, no reply as yet. He doesn't appear to have logged on to the forum since October 19th. Still hoping!

Stuart Arnot · Post by **Stuart Arnot** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:44 pm

Just read the rest of the thread. Congratulations, Innis!

Phil Reynolds · Post by **Phil Reynolds** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:04 pm

Howard Somerset wrote:
Phil Reynolds wrote:My final tourney tally stands at: won 0, lost 3, had two games awarded to me by default. I'm shit.
If only we'd been drawn against each other, Phil, then one of us would have had a non-default win. Next time, maybe.

Would love to play a standard 15-rounder against you some time, Howard.

Howard Somerset · Post by **Howard Somerset** » Fri Oct 30, 2009 11:07 pm

Phil Reynolds wrote:Would love to play a standard 15-rounder against you some time, Howard.

If I was Dinos, I'd probably reply saying you can play a round with me any time, Phil. But I'm not Dinos, so I wont. Look forward to a game soon, Phil.

Gavin Chipper · Post by **Gavin Chipper** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:22 pm

Innis Carson wrote:Division A:

Innis 137 - 129 Nick

A decent game, Nick made a few slips at the beginning but was close to pulling it back towards the end with good 6 small play. Could have very easily gone the other way I think. Cheers Nick, and cheers Charlie as well for running the tournament.

Well done for winning this. And well done to Charlie for organising it.

Kirk Bevins · Post by **Kirk Bevins** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:39 pm

I arranged with Jimmy Gough 2pm today for our numbers attack game and he hasn't been on. I've even texted him and he still hasn't come on. I have to leave at 5 to go to Cambridge so if he doesn't come on before then I'll [insert word] him.

Phil Collinge · Post by **Phil Collinge** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 9:32 pm

Division B

Edwin Mead 142-136 Phil Collinge

Well played Edwin.

Thanks to Charlie for a very well run and enjoyable tournament.

J.Levison · Post by **J.Levison** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 10:16 pm

I haven't been able to get online much this past week so Gareth should be awarded our game as he PM'd me and i've only just been able to reply

Lloyd Pettet · Post by **Lloyd Pettet** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 10:51 pm

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?game=134856

Lloyd Pettet 129 - 127 Chris Philpot

Ridiculously hard most of the way through, and a real close affair. Cheers for the game Chris and Thankyou to Charlie for a great tournament.

Barry Evans · Post by **Barry Evans** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 2:47 pm

Karen Pearson 144 - 175 Barry Evans

http://apterous.org/viewgame.php?game=135070

Karen Pearson · Post by **Karen Pearson** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 2:47 pm

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?game=135070

Barry Evans 175 - Karen Pearson 144

A very enjoyable game but Barry was just too good in the end - despite suffering from chronic sleep deprivation. By contrast, I was sober and had had a good 10 hours sleep so I have no excuse other than stupidity!!

Tyron Potts · Post by **Tyron Potts** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 7:53 pm

Division B - Me vs Andrew Feist.

I will have to concede this one. Andrew and I had arranged to play in the week, but it's my fault the match wasn't played.

Ty

James Hurrell · Post by **James Hurrell** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:38 pm

http://www.apterous.org/viewgame.php?ke ... 0430328744

DIV A - Jon Corby 142-148 James Hurrell

Real nip and tuck game going back and forth. I just happened to be ahead at R20 - could have gone either way.

Well played Corby.

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 12:38 am

Apologies, neglected to post this until now for no particular reason other than making you all think I'm uninterested and cool. That gets the girls apparently.

Division B. 'Final'
James Hall 135 - 138 Matt Morrison

Didn't really feel much like it at the time considering the relatively low score, but I guess this was a pretty good game in terms of being close and exciting.

6 rounds in, I was 17 points down after some solid efforts from James. Round 7 was a nightmare, I was a bit knobbed out about the points I'd dropped and decided to end round early 1 away on 193 (stupid in itself considering 194 wasn't hard), but due to force of habit I instinctively clicked the target itself a moment before clicking end round early, so dropped a further 7 points behind to James' 193. After 7 rounds, 4 had been scored with beatable methods.

The hit-and-miss start continued into a dodgy middle for both, shitty misdeclarations and frustrating misses. I put in a run of 8 in a row in which James missed one he'll kick himself over (r15).
4 behind for the final round and never ahead in the whole match, one of my classic 6-small-but-it's-ok-cos-it's-got-a-ten-in-it technical picks won it for me.

That final round also wasn't a max, and as James was playing from a slow hotel connection (props to him for that and hope it didn't affect his game too much), there was a huge pause after the round ended early where I had to sit in silence expecting James to be entering his better solution, only for the window to pop up for me to enter my method. Phew.
Apart from those stressful circumstances, it was fun winning on a non-max as it was only a few weeks ago I had respected numbers man Jim Bentley spewing obscenities at me because I was pissing him off by scoring on so many 'safe' declarations. Mwu haha.

Julie Russell · Post by **Julie Russell** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 1:05 pm

Sorry I'm late with this. Sent Sarah White a message on Monday and it's still to be pick up.