c4countdown

Hey folks,

I've been working tirelessly in my spare time on a Countdown App for Android phones. Once finished, this app should fill the huge gap in the market there has been for a Countdown app which is free, uses a good dictionary and actually works properly! As far as I am aware, this will be the first smartphone app for Countdown developed by somebody who actually knows the game inside out.

There's a bit more work to do before the app can go live to the Play Store, and as part of that work I need some beta testers! I'll be selecting around 5 people from the forum to join the beta phase. If you want in, please get in touch (ideally via DM here) with:
- Your Email
- Email of a friend / Family member who is not a huge Countdown geek who wants to do some beta testing
- What Android phones each of you have (Model and Android version)

Remember this is Android phones only! iOS may come in the future if the Android Launch goes well.

Best of luck with this Jack, and gimme a shout when you're doing IOS

Paul Anderson wrote: ↑Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:48 am Best of luck with this Jack, and gimme a shout when you're doing IOS

Snap

Happy to take a look at this Jack but I probably don't have a companion non-nerdy friend to accompany me.

Matt Morrison wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:39 am Happy to take a look at this Jack but I probably don't have a companion non-nerdy friend to accompany me.

Same really.

Maybe I could think of someone actually. I'll see.

Is it only 9 letter words and numbers?

Matt Morrison wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 8:39 am Happy to take a look at this Jack but I probably don't have a companion non-nerdy friend to accompany me.

Gavin Chipper wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:03 am
Same really.

Maybe I could think of someone actually. I'll see.

Sounds good to me. I'll be in touch.

Tom Carey also on board, so just looking for a couple more people.

Also happy to give it a go.

Also have no friends.

Ian Fitzpatrick wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:21 am Is it only 9 letter words and numbers?

Good question. The initial release will be pretty basic - just stand alone Letters Numbers and Conundrum modes. I'll be continuously adding new features as time goes on, so there will be lots more than this to look forward to

Fiona T wrote: ↑Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:26 am Also happy to give it a go.

Also have no friends.

Thx Fiona.

I'll be in touch.

Sure, I'll give it a go.

Thx Ben.

That gives me the 5 I desired (I had some private replies too), so for now I won't be taking any more testers. At some point in the furutre I'll bring more testers in if there are more of you out there who are keen.

Yay i think about 5 years ago i was saying an app would be brilliant and popular.
Looking forward to seeing the app on android.
More than happy to pay for a pro version i.e no ads
Happy to be part of the second wave of beta testers

Nice thread on hacking the official app - get Rob's dictionary in there!

https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1416664786444570625

If you still need testers, I can do it.
I have at least one non-nerd I can force to partake.

EDIT: hahahaha, I should have paid attention to the date this was posted, and to the content of the replies before commenting!

But, yeah, I can be a further-down-the-Greek-alphabet tester if you want... let's be topical, and go Delta.

Fiona T wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:47 pm Nice thread on hacking the official app - get Rob's dictionary in there!

https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1416664786444570625

Incredible scenes - the distribution of the vowel pile in the official Countdown app exactly matches the "rough guess" I made in 2013 for the vowel distribution used in series 66. 15 As, 20 Es, 13 Is, 13 Os, 7 Us.

Fiona T wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:47 pm Nice thread on hacking the official app - get Rob's dictionary in there!

https://twitter.com/Foone/status/1416664786444570625

This is sensational.

After quite a while being too busy with the day job to find time on this, I've managed to finally put a bit of time into getting a first draft out to some of the testers. Whoop whoop!

(Awful frame rate due to gif hosting limits)

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:34 pm But, yeah, I can be a further-down-the-Greek-alphabet tester if you want... let's be topical, and go Delta.

Marc Meakin wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:01 pm Yay i think about 5 years ago i was saying an app would be brilliant and popular.
Looking forward to seeing the app on android.
More than happy to pay for a pro version i.e no ads
Happy to be part of the second wave of beta testers

If the both of you DM me the email addresses on your google play accounts, I'll get you added in when I bring in the next list of testers. I'm sure feedback from both of you will be very valuable.

JackHurst wrote: ↑Sun Jul 25, 2021 9:31 am

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:34 pm But, yeah, I can be a further-down-the-Greek-alphabet tester if you want... let's be topical, and go Delta.

Marc Meakin wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:01 pm Yay i think about 5 years ago i was saying an app would be brilliant and popular.
Looking forward to seeing the app on android.
More than happy to pay for a pro version i.e no ads
Happy to be part of the second wave of beta testers

If the both of you DM me the email addresses on your google play accounts, I'll get you added in when I bring in the next list of testers. I'm sure feedback from both of you will be very valuable.

Second Eoin and Marc's comments. Shall DM you my address if that suits?

Tom S wrote: ↑Sun Jul 25, 2021 11:01 am Second Eoin and Marc's comments. Shall DM you my address if that suits?

Yep, please do. Goes without saying, if anybody reading this wants to be a tester, just go ahead and DM me your play store email.

Whole app is landscape now. Numbers screen looks a bit better than before too:

75*7+(100-4)/(50/25)

JackHurst wrote: ↑Sat Aug 07, 2021 3:29 pm Whole app is landscape now. Numbers screen looks a bit better than before too:

This looks great!

Can I ask what way the numbers work? One thing I don't like about the official app is that the numbers round does the calculation for you.

Noel Mc wrote: ↑Sun Aug 08, 2021 5:52 pm This looks great!

Thanks

Noel Mc wrote: ↑Sun Aug 08, 2021 5:52 pm Can I ask what way the numbers work? One thing I don't like about the official app is that the numbers round does the calculation for you.

Yes it does the calculations for you. I think your point is that it gives the player assistance that they wouldn't get on the show, and makes it a possibility to be able to fudge the numbers rounds. I agree with that sentiment completely, and if I were trying to go for something that is a hardcore competitive Countdown experience, I'd do it differently.

The primary aim is to keep it simple and intuitive for new users.

Rachel does the calculations for you. Apterous does too.

Gavin Chipper wrote: ↑Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:37 pm Rachel does the calculations for you. Apterous does too.

Not during the 30s. The point Noel is making is you effectively have the aid of a calculator during the 30s

JackHurst wrote: ↑Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:15 pm

Gavin Chipper wrote: ↑Mon Aug 09, 2021 3:37 pm Rachel does the calculations for you. Apterous does too.

Not during the 30s. The point Noel is making is you effectively have the aid of a calculator during the 30s

Yep, this is it. Although I've been trying to think of a way that you could do it on an app without calculating it for you, and I can't!

I agree that it is probably the most user friendly way!

Do people think having a scoreboard on my app will create much buzz/interest among apterites?

On the one hand, it's a blank slate, with a new place to set records.
On the other hand people might just only keep caring about apterous and TV records (e.g. nobody gives a crap about the existing Official Countdown app)

JackHurst wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:29 pm Do people think having a scoreboard on my app will create much buzz/interest among apterites?

On the one hand, it's a blank slate, with a new place to set records.
On the other hand people might just only keep caring about apterous and TV records (e.g. nobody gives a crap about the existing Official Countdown app)

I don't see any harm done by including a leaderboard, personally...

Scrabble Go has a monthly leaderboard

JackHurst wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 4:29 pm Do people think having a scoreboard on my app will create much buzz/interest among apterites?

On the one hand, it's a blank slate, with a new place to set records.
On the other hand people might just only keep caring about apterous and TV records (e.g. nobody gives a crap about the existing Official Countdown app)

hmm, dunno - would need to be a lot more robust than "did you get it"? for the numbers, and very generous times for getting your answers in. For me, it's value is a practice tool with an up to date dictionary - I'd be unlikely to make the leaderboards, and I suspect we'd see the same names

Personally if you want to enhance it, I'd suggest incorporating some of Rob's intelligence to provide fun ways of learning the most common words/9s etc.

As a bit of feedback (and def user error, but could possibly be avoided!) , it would be good to dim numbers when you've used them - I had two 3s in my selection and spent ages wondering why my 3x3 wasn't working, when I was clicking the same 3 twice!

Fiona T wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:42 pm hmm, dunno - would need to be a lot more robust than "did you get it"? for the numbers, and very generous times for getting your answers in. For me, it's value is a practice tool with an up to date dictionary - I'd be unlikely to make the leaderboards, and I suspect we'd see the same names

The numbers screen is still a work in progress. I'll definitely be making it more robust before public release.

Fiona T wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:42 pm Personally if you want to enhance it, I'd suggest incorporating some of Rob's intelligence to provide fun ways of learning the most common words/9s etc.

This will come at some point in the future. I already have a version of this that I've been using myself for over a year, but there's work to do on it to make it ready for testers. Will be in a future update for sure though!

Fiona T wrote: ↑Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:42 pm As a bit of feedback (and def user error, but could possibly be avoided!) , it would be good to dim numbers when you've used them - I had two 3s in my selection and spent ages wondering why my 3x3 wasn't working, when I was clicking the same 3 twice!

I just revisited this myself and see what you mean. I went to the effort of adding a different background for the selected numbers tile, but it's not very different from the background for an unselected tile. Can fix this up pretty quickly.

Tom S wrote: ↑Sun Jul 25, 2021 11:01 am Second Eoin and Marc's comments. Shall DM you my address if that suits?

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:34 pm If you still need testers, I can do it.

Marc Meakin wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:01 pm Happy to be part of the second wave of beta testers

Eoin Marc and Tom, if you still want to be part of testing, DM me your email addresses used for google play and I'll get you added in.

I've got room for a couple more testers to join, so if there are any lurkers out there wanting to play, please get in touch. The game now has full 15 rounder with a scoreboard! Rob currently sitting at the top with a hefty 162.

JackHurst wrote: ↑Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:15 am

Tom S wrote: ↑Sun Jul 25, 2021 11:01 am Second Eoin and Marc's comments. Shall DM you my address if that suits?

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 10:34 pm If you still need testers, I can do it.

Marc Meakin wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 6:01 pm Happy to be part of the second wave of beta testers

Eoin Marc and Tom, if you still want to be part of testing, DM me your email addresses used for google play and I'll get you added in.

I've got room for a couple more testers to join, so if there are any lurkers out there wanting to play, please get in touch. The game now has full 15 rounder with a scoreboard! Rob currently sitting at the top with a hefty 162.

I'd like to be a tester as well if possible!

Me too!

JackHurst wrote: ↑Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:15 am Eoin Marc and Tom, if you still want to be part of testing, DM me your email addresses used for google play and I'll get you added in.

Sorry, yes, I forgot about this
Please do add me in.
It's lamphmusic@gmail.com

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Tue Oct 05, 2021 10:58 pm

JackHurst wrote: ↑Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:15 am Eoin Marc and Tom, if you still want to be part of testing, DM me your email addresses used for google play and I'll get you added in.

Sorry, yes, I forgot about this
Please do add me in.
It's lamphmusic@gmail.com

Added.

Kudos to Rob Josh and TCap for being the first 3 players to post a max game. I'm no collecting the exact data yet, but I reckon we've already had over 100 15 rounders completed by the small group of testers. Nice work! I'm planning to get game recaps working by the end of the weekend if I have time.

Ok... I had a game on it, and have thoughts.

First thought:- It is amazingly good and just what the doctor ordered.
The absence of a phone App version of Apterous has been an elephant in the room for at least 7 years now. It is crazy (given how wonderfully complex Apterous is, and how much time and energy has gone into making it one of the best sites on the internet) that Charlie & pals didn't make one already.

Now having said that, it is time to be nitpicky (I assume that is the point of the testers... to complain about petty shit -so here goes!)

1. There is no music (yet). I need* some audio cue so I can use my ears to worry about time, which frees my eyes up to fully concentrate on letters.
2. Maybe I was doing something wrong, but I could not see my score onscreen until the game had ended. (I played it in landscape orientation, perhaps portrait mode would have had the score on display? idk.)
3. The ERE button pops up on screen very close to where the CONSONANT button had been (in fact, I believe their positions overlap). If you are being careless while selecting letters, you might press the consonant button one time too many and end up EREing by accident.

There's the negative feedback for now.

---------------------------------------------------

Positive feedback... pretty much everything imaginable is good, but I'll single out a few things:-

1. It looks great.
2. The buttons click very successfully.
3. It plays fast and easy.
4. Less of a learning curve on how to do the nums than there is on Apto (though I did balls up my first round coz I didn't use it right).
5. Whatever letters distribution / shuffling algorithm you are using is as good as TV or Apto, so that is a major plus point. I had worried it might be similar to the trickier (and incorrect) co-event or Zoomdown method.
6. Showing all the "maxes -1" as well as the maxes, was a nice touch. Apto could do well to follow your example on that.
7. I appreciate that William Shakespeare maxed the only game he played back in 1970. I would expect no less of the bard.

---------------------------------------------------

*I say "need", but I did score over 120pts with no music, and that's well above my average game score.

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:57 am 1. There is no music (yet). I need* some audio cue so I can use my ears to worry about time, which frees my eyes up to fully concentrate on letters.
2. Maybe I was doing something wrong, but I could not see my score onscreen until the game had ended. (I played it in landscape orientation, perhaps portrait mode would have had the score on display? idk.)
3. The ERE button pops up on screen very close to where the CONSONANT button had been (in fact, I believe their positions overlap). If you are being careless while selecting letters, you might press the consonant button one time too many and end up EREing by accident.

Thanks for the feedback Eoin. All three of these are things I plan to address. Music will probably be the trickiest because I am not a very musical person haha.

JackHurst wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 8:47 am

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 12:57 am 1. There is no music (yet). I need* some audio cue so I can use my ears to worry about time, which frees my eyes up to fully concentrate on letters.
2. Maybe I was doing something wrong, but I could not see my score onscreen until the game had ended. (I played it in landscape orientation, perhaps portrait mode would have had the score on display? idk.)
3. The ERE button pops up on screen very close to where the CONSONANT button had been (in fact, I believe their positions overlap). If you are being careless while selecting letters, you might press the consonant button one time too many and end up EREing by accident.

Thanks for the feedback Eoin. All three of these are things I plan to address. Music will probably be the trickiest because I am not a very musical person haha.

Paul Anderson entered the room!

Good app. Finally got round to playing it. Numbers are weird but I can see myself getting used to it it's not a bad system. Obviously you can scum it by ending games if you don't have nines available in the first couple rounds but it looks like nobody's done that yet. Overall pretty good. Definitely preferable to apterous on mobile in terms of interface and not having Ronan buzz in before your mobile keyboard has popped up. I guess I don't really play prune in 15s on apto because I don't have the attention span and it shows when I'm using this thing good stuff though. Thanks Jack. I need sleep oh so desperately

Agree with Eoin re: scores - would be great to see as you go - that would be the biggest improvement to the 15R for me. Perhaps also you pick/app picks would be a nice feature.

On the numbers if you don't have the target I think you need to 'Finish' to score - is that correct?

One other very nitpicky thing - the heading when you finish numbers successfully is weird - something like "Here's how to do it" then no method just that you've done it

Fiona T wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 9:15 am On the numbers if you don't have the target I think you need to 'Finish' to score - is that correct?

The game will always remember your closest answer and give you points for that (even if you hit reset). You are not the only person to ask this question though, so it's something I need to make clearer to the user. I'll put a "Your closest: XYZ" somewhere on the screen.

Fiona T wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 9:15 am One other very nitpicky thing - the heading when you finish numbers successfully is weird - something like "Here's how to do it" then no method just that you've done it

Good spot. I think the numbers result screen is one of the worst parts at the moment, so I'll have a think about how to rewrite it to be better.

Re: Music

I have offered to write/find something, but having no access is a bit of a barrier.

Paul Anderson wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 10:48 am Re: Music

I have offered to write/find something, but having no access is a bit of a barrier.

Classic Paul C.A. Anderson right there! "Having no access" makes you somehow unable to make a 30s ditty.
Complaining about 'access' is a weird way to try put yourself front and centre, but no better man to find a way.

JackHurst wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 10:19 am

Fiona T wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 9:15 am On the numbers if you don't have the target I think you need to 'Finish' to score - is that correct?

The game will always remember your closest answer and give you points for that (even if you hit reset). You are not the only person to ask this question though, so it's something I need to make clearer to the user. I'll put a "Your closest: XYZ" somewhere on the screen.

I wonder if a conscious 'submit' button might be better - otherwise it's fudgedown Not a biggie tho.

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 1:17 pm Classic Paul C.A. Anderson right there! "Having no access" makes you somehow unable to make a 30s ditty.
Complaining about 'access' is a weird way to try put yourself front and centre, but no better man to find a way.

You're not really making much effort on this hatchet burying/relationship building stuff, are you...

Fiona T wrote: ↑Sat Oct 09, 2021 1:26 pm You're not really making much effort on this hatchet burying/relationship building stuff, are you...

Paul knows I love him really.
But the massive ego stuff has to be called out from time to time to help keep him grounded.

Erm, access to the thing you're writing music for is paramount and nowt to do with ego.

But you already know what you're writing for. 30s Countdown round music. The brief could not be any more specific, and you've already (kind of) done it for ZD.

For fun, if you'd like our massive egos to go head to head... I will write a 30s round music theme for Jack's new thing, and you write one... and Jack can have his pick of which one he thinks is better.

Don't get me started. I was already thinking of composing something to send to the BBC for next year's Eurovision... and as someone who scored 93% for the Composing Module in my GCSE in Music (albeit 7 years ago), I fancy my chances...

Never going to pass up the opportunity for a bit of bragging, so... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVGDFXW ... e=youtu.be

I just posted an update today which means you will be able to view other players games. CPU also picks 50% of the rounds now too.

In order to do this update I had to wipe the scoreboard data. RIP Rob's 164 15 rounde rand TCaps 203 Letters x 20

JackHurst wrote: ↑Sun Oct 31, 2021 1:35 pm I just posted an update today which means you will be able to view other players games. CPU also picks 50% of the rounds now too.

In order to do this update I had to wipe the scoreboard data. RIP Rob's 164 15 rounde rand TCaps 203 Letters x 20

Thanks Jack - it's really coming along nicely

Two minor picky things - would be really nice to have an indicator on screen of what round number you're playing.
When it switches to the progress board, it would be good to scroll so that the round you just played is at the bottom of the screen.

But really like the changes - looking really good

Can't get into it at the moment as it tells me that the dictionary is updating each time I log in. Will uninstall and reinstall in the hope that things will have resolved themselves.

Tom S wrote: ↑Mon Nov 01, 2021 10:59 am Can't get into it at the moment as it tells me that the dictionary is updating each time I log in. Will uninstall and reinstall in the hope that things will have resolved themselves.

Looks like I made a mistake migrating the dictionary for beta users. Reinstalling or cleaning app data will fix the issue.

If this kind of thing happens after public release I'll make a patch so people don't have to reinstall.

JackHurst wrote: ↑Mon Nov 01, 2021 11:48 am

Tom S wrote: ↑Mon Nov 01, 2021 10:59 am Can't get into it at the moment as it tells me that the dictionary is updating each time I log in. Will uninstall and reinstall in the hope that things will have resolved themselves.

Looks like I made a mistake migrating the dictionary for beta users. Reinstalling or cleaning app data will fix the issue.

If this kind of thing happens after public release I'll make a patch so people don't have to reinstall.

It's all sorted now Like the new feature which enables you to look at other people's games, and agree with Fiona re-round numbers. Think the CPU should be optional, as some players may prefer to pick all of their selections. It's all shaping up nicely, though!

Fiona T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 31, 2021 2:09 pm Two minor picky things - would be really nice to have an indicator on screen of what round number you're playing.
When it switches to the progress board, it would be good to scroll so that the round you just played is at the bottom of the screen.

Good ideas. Will do both of these.

JackHurst wrote: ↑Mon Nov 01, 2021 1:50 pm

Fiona T wrote: ↑Sun Oct 31, 2021 2:09 pm Two minor picky things - would be really nice to have an indicator on screen of what round number you're playing.
When it switches to the progress board, it would be good to scroll so that the round you just played is at the bottom of the screen.

Good ideas. Will do both of these.

Done.

Some very competitive scores being posted on the scoreboard for 15 rounder so far

Incredibly pedantic comment on my part, but am wondering as to whether CPU's selection of the letters is randomised? I only wonder as it comes across that way. Also, wondering as to whether there'll be a variant which will enable players to pick all of the letters and numbers selections in a 15 rounder? All shaping up nicely though, nonetheless.

Tom S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 07, 2021 1:27 pm Incredibly pedantic comment on my part, but am wondering as to whether CPU's selection of the letters is randomised? I only wonder as it comes across that way.

Yes it's randomised. Most of the time it will pick 3c 4v in some permutation for the first 7, but in theory any legal pattern is possible.

Tom S wrote: ↑Tue Dec 07, 2021 1:27 pm Also, wondering as to whether there'll be a variant which will enable players to pick all of the letters and numbers selections in a 15 rounder? All shaping up nicely though, nonetheless.

Eventually there will be a "practise mode" with no time limit where you can pick all letters. I think this version won't have a score board though.