The C4C Football Thread

Jeffrey Burgin · Post by **Jeffrey Burgin** » Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:55 pm

David Roe wrote:By "most passionate" presumably you mean "most obnoxious, unpleasant, antisocial, violent"? It's a throwback to the 70's, which by the tone of your comment, presumably you're in favour of?

By most passionate I meant in terms of atmosphere- the difference between, say, my own team's Craven Cottage and Upton Park is obviously noticeable. I'd consider it a bit harsh to say all fans of West Ham and Millwall are obnoxious, unpleasant, antisocial and violent- the actions of a mindless few should not tarnish the thousands who, whilst engaging in chanting perhaps a bit more passionate than usual, chose to act sensibly and didn't go running amok. I am wholeheartedly not in favour of a return to 70s hooliganism- for clarification, when I said I couldn't believe the papers were up in arms I didn't mean I couldn't understand why they were making a big deal of it, I meant I couldn't believe they were so surprised at the events that unfolded. The police comment referred to the fact that many said, though the police acted commendably with restraint, there simply weren't enough present to prevent the levels of hooliganism and I would have thought the Met would have known better. If it was anything else that suggested my approval of mindless thuggery please enlighten me.

David Roe · Post by **David Roe** » Thu Aug 27, 2009 12:16 am

I apologise for misunderstanding.

It was the whole tone of the post - admiration of passionate supporters, reference to football "firms" which gave (me, at least) the impression that you thought they were legitimate organisations, blaming the police for the fighting without blaming anyone else such as the men doing the fighting ... the whole tone seemed to be non-condemnatory. And if you're not with us in this issue, then you're against us. IMO.

But on the other hand, it's no more or no less true that all West Ham fans are obnoxious etc., than it is true that they're all passionate. Compared with Fulham, a higher proportion are more passionate, and a higher proportion are hooligans. (That may not be true of Millwall supporters. I think they're all hooligans. Though that can't be literally true.) Oddly enough, the West Ham mob and the Burnley mob (we have more than our share, though they have by and large been quiet and/or absent for a good few years, touch wood) always got on well together. Simply because both sides wear claret and blue. Pathetic, really.

Jeffrey Burgin · Post by **Jeffrey Burgin** » Thu Aug 27, 2009 8:45 am

David Roe wrote:I apologise for misunderstanding.

It was the whole tone of the post - admiration of passionate supporters, reference to football "firms" which gave (me, at least) the impression that you thought they were legitimate organisations, blaming the police for the fighting without blaming anyone else such as the men doing the fighting ... the whole tone seemed to be non-condemnatory. And if you're not with us in this issue, then you're against us. IMO.

No worries- I don't see why admiration of passionate supporters is a bad thing necessarily though. As a fan of Fulham, who are probably best described as genteel bordering on enthusiastic, I'd love to experience the atmosphere at Anfield, the Britannia or indeed your own Turf Moor. The reference to the firms only meant that these are two clubs with, alongside Chelsea, Leeds and Cardiff, the most notorious hooligan histories and I can't believe the police didn't act more accordingly. Indeed, at Millwall vs Leeds matches, away fans have been banned to prevent trouble- doing this would have allowed more police to be diverted to controlling events outside the stadium and the images of fans fighting each other in the stadium which will probably do damage to our 2018 bid would never have happened.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 5:26 pm

Another top display from Rafa's Liverpool. Amazing how someone so mediocre can last so long.

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 5:42 pm

Craig Beevers wrote:Another top display from Rafa's Liverpool. Amazing how someone so mediocre can last so long.

Haha Craig. I have no idea of the history behind you and Liverpool but it's funny seeing you jump on us every chance you can get.
Not many of us Liverpool fans agree wholeheartedly with everything Rafa does, but he's still the best we've had for a while.
You don't need to look further than Chelsea to see that changing things up every 6 months doesn't work.
Everyone has been pestering Rafa for a couple of years to be more adventurous and throw caution to the wind. You could arguably say that's exactly what he's done this season, and look how shit we're doing.

On a side note, Chelsea - yawn. They absolutely have to be the most unapologetically boring side in the whole league.
I'd rather watch ANY two Premier League teams play than a Chelsea match. And it's not about hating - my dislike for Man Utd must out-hate Chelsea by a factor of at least 20, but I don't mind watching Man Utd. I literally have no idea how Chelsea fans stomach it. Also, I've never been one for all this "I hope someone breaks his leg" type stuff (having been a victim of a broken leg myself) but it's about time someone showed Drogba what pain is.

Michael Wallace · Post by **Michael Wallace** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 5:44 pm

So it's one thing to see your team concede 6 goals in one game, but I thought I'd at least get some consolation by having van Persie in my fantasy football team...

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 5:48 pm

Michael Wallace wrote:So it's one thing to see your team concede 6 goals in one game, but I thought I'd at least get some consolation by having van Persie in my fantasy football team...

Yeah, right, painful. I subbed him in and made him captain. Would have been pleased if he'd scored the goal that won the match at 1-0, but with Fabregas there (who I could have afforded and worked into my team instead), RVP just ended up looking like an also ran despite scoring the most points for me this week behind Bent!

RVP: 1 goal, 2 bonus points. And then 1 yellow card.
Fabregas: 1 goal, 4 assists, 3 bonus points. Arrghhh.

Michael Wallace · Post by **Michael Wallace** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 5:57 pm

Matt Morrison wrote:
Michael Wallace wrote:So it's one thing to see your team concede 6 goals in one game, but I thought I'd at least get some consolation by having van Persie in my fantasy football team...
Yeah, right, painful. I subbed him in and made him captain. Would have been pleased if he'd scored the goal that won the match at 1-0, but with Fabregas there (who I could have afforded and worked into my team instead), RVP just ended up looking like an also ran despite scoring the most points for me this week behind Bent!

RVP: 1 goal, 2 bonus points. And then 1 yellow card.
Fabregas: 1 goal, 4 assists, 3 bonus points. Arrghhh.

Yep, had him as my captain too (I also had Diaby, where the fuck was he?). My only consolation was that Chelsea managed to hold off Liverpool, which was good because I don't have Torres (I hung onto to him until a couple of weeks ago, just before his two week spell where he scored as many fantasy league points as he'd done the entire season).

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:02 pm

Michael Wallace wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:
Michael Wallace wrote:So it's one thing to see your team concede 6 goals in one game, but I thought I'd at least get some consolation by having van Persie in my fantasy football team...
Yeah, right, painful. I subbed him in and made him captain. Would have been pleased if he'd scored the goal that won the match at 1-0, but with Fabregas there (who I could have afforded and worked into my team instead), RVP just ended up looking like an also ran despite scoring the most points for me this week behind Bent!

RVP: 1 goal, 2 bonus points. And then 1 yellow card.
Fabregas: 1 goal, 4 assists, 3 bonus points. Arrghhh.
Yep, had him as my captain too (I also had Diaby, where the fuck was he?). My only consolation was that Chelsea managed to hold off Liverpool, which was good because I don't have Torres (I hung onto to him until a couple of weeks ago, just before his two week spell where he scored as many fantasy league points as he'd done the entire season).

Hehe, Diaby for me too, the rascal! Seriously bad week for me - Bent and RVP literally scored more than my other 9 players put together.

I've had Torres in since the week before he started coming good (as a Liverpool fan I could see it coming), however I'll readily admit to fucking up the West Ham match, didn't expect that to be so open and took him off captaincy, and tried the pretty-stupid-looking-if-it-goes-wrong-but-you-get-called-a-genius-if-it-works-out tactic of putting Hangeland as captain. Torres obviously scored two and got bonus points galore while Hangeland got nothing but 2 points for showing up.

Alec Rivers · Post by **Alec Rivers** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:26 pm

Matt Morrison wrote:On a side note, Chelsea - yawn. They absolutely have to be the most unapologetically boring side in the whole league.

Was thinking the same thing myself. I don't believe they give a moment's thought to entertaining their fans (or the viewing public at large), only to winning at all costs. At least Wenger's ethos is to play the purest form of the beautiful game, and I believe his team's entertainment value is important to him.

Matt Morrison wrote:... it's about time someone showed Drogba what pain is.

I am so with you on this, too. I lost count today of the number of times he received a little tap and hit the deck like a sack of shit. I pity players who put so much effort into learning how to con the officials.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:52 pm

Matt Morrison wrote:
Craig Beevers wrote:Another top display from Rafa's Liverpool. Amazing how someone so mediocre can last so long.
Haha Craig. I have no idea of the history behind you and Liverpool but it's funny seeing you jump on us every chance you can get.
Not many of us Liverpool fans agree wholeheartedly with everything Rafa does, but he's still the best we've had for a while.
You don't need to look further than Chelsea to see that changing things up every 6 months doesn't work.
Everyone has been pestering Rafa for a couple of years to be more adventurous and throw caution to the wind. You could arguably say that's exactly what he's done this season, and look how shit we're doing.

No history, just feel the urge to hammer the point home until people finally get it. The guy is just as poor as previous managers, but he's had a huge net spend and fluked two trophies.

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 7:05 pm

Craig Beevers wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:
Craig Beevers wrote:Another top display from Rafa's Liverpool. Amazing how someone so mediocre can last so long.
Haha Craig. I have no idea of the history behind you and Liverpool but it's funny seeing you jump on us every chance you can get.
Not many of us Liverpool fans agree wholeheartedly with everything Rafa does, but he's still the best we've had for a while.
You don't need to look further than Chelsea to see that changing things up every 6 months doesn't work.
Everyone has been pestering Rafa for a couple of years to be more adventurous and throw caution to the wind. You could arguably say that's exactly what he's done this season, and look how shit we're doing.
No history, just feel the urge to hammer the point home until people finally get it. The guy is just as poor as previous managers, but he's had a huge net spend and fluked two trophies.

The net spend since Rafa arrived is significantly less than Manchester United's, and yet in 2004 we were 17 points behind and in 2009, just the 4. Sorry mate, but you talk a fucking load of shit.

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 7:05 pm

Quite frankly you embarrass yourself. Will you be bumping this thread every time Liverpool lose?

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 9:24 pm

Jon O'Neill wrote:
Craig Beevers wrote: No history, just feel the urge to hammer the point home until people finally get it. The guy is just as poor as previous managers, but he's had a huge net spend and fluked two trophies.
The net spend since Rafa arrived is significantly less than Manchester United's, and yet in 2004 we were 17 points behind and in 2009, just the 4. Sorry mate, but you talk a fucking load of shit.

http://transferleague.co.uk/

Suggests a completely different version of reality.

Oh and Liverpool were flattered by that margin. Manure won comfortably in the end despite Liverpool doing the double over them if I remember correctly (think one involved a 90+ minute winner as well). That's the difference. Liverpool will have their bit of luck one season and still finish an also-ran. Another time they'll get injuries, get beaten by the top sides and they'll be back to the sorts of margin you had in 2004.

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 9:54 pm

Craig Beevers wrote:
Jon O'Neill wrote:
Craig Beevers wrote: No history, just feel the urge to hammer the point home until people finally get it. The guy is just as poor as previous managers, but he's had a huge net spend and fluked two trophies.
The net spend since Rafa arrived is significantly less than Manchester United's, and yet in 2004 we were 17 points behind and in 2009, just the 4. Sorry mate, but you talk a fucking load of shit.
http://transferleague.co.uk/

Suggests a completely different version of reality.

Well I obviously wasn't counting this year's 70 million differential as I was comparing the 2009 and 2004 seasons. The rest is not worth consideration because it's so thick.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Sun Oct 04, 2009 10:17 pm

Yes 'net spend since Rafa arrived' clearly only means certain bits of the last 5 years where your argument doesn't fall apart.

David Williams · Post by **David Williams** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:35 am

Would have liked to contribute to this discussion but I was travelling home from a football match. Sorry. You probably know much more than I do anyway.

Matthew Green · Post by **Matthew Green** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:37 am

I'd have to side with Craig on this one. I would stake my mortgage on Liverpool never winning the league under Benitez. I'm all for giving managers time and patience to make it happen (Ferguson, Moyes, Wenger) but he just isn't able to make them consistent enough. Last year was the easiest chance he'll get and he still blew it by dropping points in easy games. Never gonna happen...

David Williams · Post by **David Williams** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:41 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yMirJPi_mI

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 7:01 pm

David Williams wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yMirJPi_mI

Haha! I fucking love Didi Hamann.

Richard Brittain · Post by **Richard Brittain** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:36 pm

I feel sorry for Liverpool fans because the club is by a long way the least popular of the big 4 in media circles. It seems that Craig is deeply influenced by what he reads and hears.

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:41 pm

Richard Brittain wrote:I feel sorry for Liverpool fans because the club is by a long way the least popular of the big 4 in media circles. It seems that Craig is deeply influenced by what he reads and hears.

Yeah I'd agree with that, other than the ex-Liverpool MOTD pundits we haven't got much good press over the last couple of years. Interestingly, unless I'm very much mistaken, we are very much the most popular of the big 4 for neutral fans.

Derek Hazell · Post by **Derek Hazell** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:46 pm

Jon O'Neill wrote:Haha! I fucking love Diddy Hamilton.

Wow, I would have thought he'd have been a bit before your time.

Anyway, he support Fulham.

Michael Wallace · Post by **Michael Wallace** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:48 pm

Matt Morrison wrote:Interestingly, unless I'm very much mistaken, we are very much the most popular of the big 4 for neutral fans.

If that's true I'd wonder how much is because you're seen as the 'underdogs', having not won the league in so long.

Richard Brittain · Post by **Richard Brittain** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:56 pm

Despite the superficial fact that MOTD has one or two ex-Liverpool pundits, the BBC as a corporation are in general obsessed with Man Utd, and Chelsea and Arsenal to a lesser extent because they are the cosmopolitan London-based clubs. The bias in the popular newspapers is more or less the same.

Chelsea play a very spoiling style of football, and in general are a dull team to watch, but they have pace and power up front and a lot of physical strength throughout their team, so I think they are favourites for the title at this time.

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 8:57 pm

Michael Wallace wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:Interestingly, unless I'm very much mistaken, we are very much the most popular of the big 4 for neutral fans.
If that's true I'd wonder how much is because you're seen as the 'underdogs', having not won the league in so long.

Yeah, quite probably a factor. In general I think we're seen as pretty exciting to watch too, and definitely heavy scorers. Plus we don't really have any arrogant typically hateworthy players (such as Rooney, Ronaldo, Drogba, Henry, and so on).

Richard Brittain · Post by **Richard Brittain** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:12 pm

Matt Morrison wrote:
Michael Wallace wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:Interestingly, unless I'm very much mistaken, we are very much the most popular of the big 4 for neutral fans.
If that's true I'd wonder how much is because you're seen as the 'underdogs', having not won the league in so long.
Yeah, quite probably a factor. In general I think we're seen as pretty exciting to watch too, and definitely heavy scorers. Plus we don't really have any arrogant typically hateworthy players (such as Rooney, Ronaldo, Drogba, Henry, and so on).

Definitely, I think it's great that the Premier League has a manager such as Rafa Benitez, so devoted to all-out attacking football and classy play. Craig has almost certainly read in the newspapers that Liverpool are a defensive team under Benitez, but the facts speak for themselves; Liverpool scored more than anyone last season and are again right up at the top of the scoring charts this season.

I've noticed that arrogant people tend to hate Benitez, because arrogant people tend to hate other arrogant people, and Benitez is definitely arrogant. However, Benitez has reason to be arrogant; he's a top manager currently leading the third biggest football club in the world (behind Real and Milan). And I'd wager that 99% of the people who hate him, such as Piers Morgan and all the other scumbag journalists, have no reason at all to be arrogant, but are just self-conceited fools.

Matthew Green · Post by **Matthew Green** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:15 pm

I hate Dirk Kuyt, passionately.

One, because he is no better, worse or different than Paul Dickov and two, because he looks far too much like the guy who was the original suspect in the Bodyguard.

Richard Brittain · Post by **Richard Brittain** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:19 pm

I'd be interested to hear how many people here hate Peter Crouch. Because I've noticed that a lot of people have an instinctive tendency to hate Peter Crouch, for no good reason.

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:28 pm

Richard Brittain wrote:I'd be interested to hear how many people here hate Peter Crouch. Because I've noticed that a lot of people have an instinctive tendency to hate Peter Crouch, for no good reason.

I love Peter Crouch, but I think the people who hate him might do so because they have small person syndrome. They are jealous of his height.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:37 pm

I don't read newspapers. I ignore most punditry on TV because most people talk out of their arse or are heavily biased in some way - taking much notice of the BBC's views on anything Liverpool for example is not advisable.

My opinion of Liverpool is they generally have a somewhat awkward style of play. It makes it a little harder for teams to be fluent (both them and the opponents). It's a good set-up for 2-legged ties against top sides but not so great for efficiently disposing of weaker sides in the league.

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:21 pm

Craig Beevers wrote:My opinion of Liverpool is they generally have a somewhat awkward style of play. It makes it a little harder for teams to be fluent (both them and the opponents). It's a good set-up for 2-legged ties against top sides but not so great for efficiently disposing of weaker sides in the league.

I think you need to specify whether you're talking about right now, or in recent seasons. We really struggled with the small teams last season (0-0 Stoke, 2-2 Hull), but this season (4-0 Stoke, 4-0 Burnley, 6-1 Hull) it's looking like being a different story, and our 'set-up' hasn't changed anywhere near as much as this swing in results would seem to suggest.

Also, a style of play which "makes it a little harder for teams to be fluent (both them and the opponents)" seems to describe Chelsea infinitely better than it would Liverpool. Once we get going we're pretty fluent indeed, it's just the trouble in some occasions is the getting going in the first place.

James Robinson · Post by **James Robinson** » Tue Oct 06, 2009 10:49 am

Jon O'Neill wrote:
Richard Brittain wrote:I'd be interested to hear how many people here hate Peter Crouch. Because I've noticed that a lot of people have an instinctive tendency to hate Peter Crouch, for no good reason.
I love Peter Crouch, but I think the people who hate him might do so because they have small person syndrome. They are jealous of his height.

Yeah, Crouchy is a very good player. I can't understand how anyone can hate him. He's such a likable guy.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Tue Oct 06, 2009 11:51 am

Matt Morrison wrote:
Craig Beevers wrote:My opinion of Liverpool is they generally have a somewhat awkward style of play. It makes it a little harder for teams to be fluent (both them and the opponents). It's a good set-up for 2-legged ties against top sides but not so great for efficiently disposing of weaker sides in the league.
I think you need to specify whether you're talking about right now, or in recent seasons. We really struggled with the small teams last season (0-0 Stoke, 2-2 Hull), but this season (4-0 Stoke, 4-0 Burnley, 6-1 Hull) it's looking like being a different story, and our 'set-up' hasn't changed anywhere near as much as this swing in results would seem to suggest.

Also, a style of play which "makes it a little harder for teams to be fluent (both them and the opponents)" seems to describe Chelsea infinitely better than it would Liverpool. Once we get going we're pretty fluent indeed, it's just the trouble in some occasions is the getting going in the first place.

As I say they're generally awkward, it does seem they're a little different this season. Liverpool's normal style leads to a more basic type of football. High tempo, not particularly stylish, more direct. The awkwardness is from that it isn't really conducive to consistent high quality attacking football that the likes of Arsenal, Barcelona etc. produce.

D Eadie · Post by **D Eadie** » Fri Oct 09, 2009 4:07 pm

Didn't realise there were a couple of Clampets using this forum.

I suppose having 6 fingers helps with the typing though.

Steve Durney · Post by **Steve Durney** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:04 pm

Five points seperating four teams in the C4C Fantasy Football league, but Matt's running away with it at the moment. Surprised only 5 people from this forum joined up though.

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Mon Oct 19, 2009 11:26 pm

Steve Durney wrote:Five points seperating four teams in the C4C Fantasy Football league, but Matt's running away with it at the moment. Surprised only 5 people from this forum joined up though.

I'm doing poo tang compared to what I was up to last season as well, come on boys!

Steve Durney · Post by **Steve Durney** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 1:10 am

Matt Morrison wrote:
Steve Durney wrote:Five points seperating four teams in the C4C Fantasy Football league, but Matt's running away with it at the moment. Surprised only 5 people from this forum joined up though.
I'm doing poo tang compared to what I was up to last season as well, come on boys!

I was hoping / expecting Owen to get off to a flyer this season (but still hoping Manure would get walloped of course!

), but hasn't quite happened. Eduardo would have had a lot more points were it not for injury. Still reluctant to take them both out the team though.

Edit: Completely forgot that I replaced Eduardo with Bent last week!!

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:23 am

Steve Durney wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:
Steve Durney wrote:Five points seperating four teams in the C4C Fantasy Football league, but Matt's running away with it at the moment. Surprised only 5 people from this forum joined up though.
I'm doing poo tang compared to what I was up to last season as well, come on boys!
I was hoping / expecting Owen to get off to a flyer this season (but still hoping Manure would get walloped of course! ), but hasn't quite happened. Eduardo would have had a lot more points were it not for injury. Still reluctant to take them both out the team though.

Edit: Completely forgot that I replaced Eduardo with Bent last week!!

Hmm Owen is one of those who takes about 10 games to get into 'form' - which coincidentally is about the longest he can play before getting injured again.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Tue Oct 20, 2009 9:50 pm

*whistles nonchalantly*

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 4:59 pm

So are Liverpool fans still rating Rafa Benitez' management ability then?

Eoin Monaghan · Post by **Eoin Monaghan** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:07 pm

Fulham - 3 - 1 - Liverpool

Off:

Carragher
Degen

Alec Rivers · Post by **Alec Rivers** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:34 pm

Eoin Monaghan wrote:Fulham - 3 - 1 - Liverpool

Off:

Carragher
Degen

LIVERPOO

ARSENAL 3 - 0 TOTTERING HOTSPURTS

Eoin Monaghan · Post by **Eoin Monaghan** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:42 pm

Alec Rivers wrote:
Eoin Monaghan wrote:Fulham - 3 - 1 - Liverpool

Off:

Carragher
Degen

LIVERPOO

ARSENAL 3 - 0 TOTTERING HOTSPURTS

Liverpoo - 1 - 2 - Lyon

Steve Durney · Post by **Steve Durney** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 6:09 pm

Alec Rivers wrote:
Eoin Monaghan wrote: ARSENAL 3 - 0 TOTTERING HOTSPURTS

Matthew Green · Post by **Matthew Green** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 6:19 pm

I'm with you Craig, Benitez is a joke. I have no idea why he's been given this long when they haven't made any progress in 5 years.

Mourinho will be there next September.

Alec Rivers · Post by **Alec Rivers** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 6:54 pm

Steve Durney wrote:
Alec Rivers wrote:
Eoin Monaghan wrote: ARSENAL 3 - 0 TOTTERING HOTSPURTS

That was my post!

Steve Durney · Post by **Steve Durney** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 7:04 pm

Alec Rivers wrote: That was my post!

Soz. Deleted the wrong bit! Superb win though!

Alec Rivers · Post by **Alec Rivers** » Sat Oct 31, 2009 7:34 pm

Steve Durney wrote:
Alec Rivers wrote: That was my post!
Soz. Deleted the wrong bit! Superb win though!

np. I was just being childish cos I really like that emoticon.

Yes, brilliant win. Had me jumping up and down quite a lot. (For the pedantic: Yes, the 'down' part was inevitable.)

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 7:55 pm

Craig Beevers wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:Haha Craig. I have no idea of the history behind you and Liverpool but it's funny seeing you jump on us every chance you can get.
No history, just feel the urge to hammer the point home until people finally get it.

Sorry if you think I'm harping on this Craig, but it still reads like a shit excuse. Is it just Benitez's shitness then, not Liverpool's at large, that you are so vehemently attempting to open people's eyes to?
"No history" sounds like you don't really care, which obviously goes against every anti-Liverpool post you make.
There are plenty of things we all strongly believe might be true, but they don't tend to bother us if we don't care, if there's "no history".
I can't help but feel you were once beaten up by a scouser, or Benitez's niece-in-law once pipped one of your friends to a job or something.

Anyway, yeah, in agreeance, we suck so hard right now. Come midweek we're fairly likely to have fuck all except the FA Cup to play for, so it smells like a great time to give Mourinho or someone half a year to get settled in for next season.

Steve Durney · Post by **Steve Durney** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:01 pm

Matt Morrison wrote:
Craig Beevers wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:Haha Craig. I have no idea of the history behind you and Liverpool but it's funny seeing you jump on us every chance you can get.
No history, just feel the urge to hammer the point home until people finally get it.
Sorry if you think I'm harping on this Craig, but it still reads like a shit excuse. Is it just Benitez's shitness then, not Liverpool's at large, that you are so vehemently attempting to open people's eyes to?
"No history" sounds like you don't really care, which obviously goes against every anti-Liverpool post you make.
There are plenty of things we all strongly believe might be true, but they don't tend to bother us if we don't care, if there's "no history".
I can't help but feel you were once beaten up by a scouser, or Benitez's niece-in-law once pipped one of your friends to a job or something.

Anyway, yeah, in agreeance, we suck so hard right now. Come midweek we're fairly likely to have fuck all except the FA Cup to play for, so it smells like a great time to give Mourinho or someone half a year to get settled in for next season.

Who do you support Craig?

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:17 pm

It's the way they (Liverpool, their players and the manager) are so massively over-rated that I find irritating.

Oh and I don't support any club teams in any sport except for Durham CCC. I'm much more interested in national sport.

Richard Brittain · Post by **Richard Brittain** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:56 pm

Craig Beevers wrote:It's the way they (Liverpool, their players and the manager) are so massively over-rated that I find irritating.

Which players do you consider overrated, and by whom? The general consensus in the national media is that Liverpool only have two players, Gerrard and Torres. So I'm guessing you consider one of these overrated? Also, which sources do you consider overrate Liverpool as a team, and why?

Charlie Reams · Post by **Charlie Reams** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:08 pm

Richard Brittain wrote:Also, which sources do you consider overrate Liverpool as a team, and why?

[12 marks]

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:30 pm

This thread is a joke.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:42 pm

As I said before I don't follow much of what the media reports, I watch the football and follow scores and the odd story on the BBC (who in turn will influence most of the rest of the media). The way the BBC and fans were banging on about how unlucky they were last season not to win the league (when in fact they had virtually everything go their way and still comfortably fell short) and the likes of Hansen having them as favourites this season. You have significant numbers of people who believe Gerrard is a world beater when he is barely a starting XI player for England (lucky to be as much as that really). Similarly they go on about Carragher as if he was such a huge loss to England, who's just a good club player and nothing else. Then you have the BBC reporting on the 'injury crisis' because Liverpool have lost all of 2-3 players to injury for a couple of matches. Found it pretty funny when people go on as if Gerrard is as big a loss as Torres too. Torres is in a completely different league to Gerrard.

The trouble is people are daft enough to absorb this bollocks. It becomes self-reinforcing because there are very few people with a brain involved to form their own opinion and go against the flow (BBC pundits are basically clones but with different aesthetics). Particularly as humans in general are lacking in objectivity. It's not like football has some clear indicators of performance for individuals, unlike say cricket which has lots of very relevant statistics. So when someone says Gerrard has great technical ability you can't just look at some stat which shows 80% of the time his second touch is a tackle (just behind Michael Owen in that regard).

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:59 pm

Craig Beevers wrote:The trouble is people are daft enough to absorb this bollocks. It becomes self-reinforcing because there are very few people with a brain involved to form their own opinion and go against the flow (BBC pundits are basically clones but with different aesthetics). Particularly as humans in general are lacking in objectivity. It's not like football has some clear indicators of performance for individuals, unlike say cricket which has lots of very relevant statistics. So when someone says Gerrard has great technical ability you can't just look at some stat which shows 80% of the time his second touch is a tackle (just behind Michael Owen in that regard).

I agree with this. Now, watch a Liverpool game (not an England one, where he is played grossly out of position) and observe Gerrard closely, with no preconceptions. If you can't see how he is a cut above then you're seriously missing something. It's a bit like how the less knowledgeable Liverpool fans say Rooney is shit. The pair of them are outstanding players, and you won't find anyone with a clue about football saying anything to the contrary. Which is why I think you don't have a clue. That and almost every other post in this thread.

Jon O'Neill · Post by **Jon O'Neill** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 11:04 pm

Oh and one more thing.. if you think Mourinho a suitable manager for LFC, then you are no fan of LFC.

Matt Morrison · Post by **Matt Morrison** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 1:13 am

Jon O'Neill wrote:
Matt Morrison wrote:Come midweek we're fairly likely to have fuck all except the FA Cup to play for, so it smells like a great time to give Mourinho or someone half a year to get settled in for next season.
Oh and one more thing.. if you think Mourinho a suitable manager for LFC, then you are no fan of LFC.

Yeah, oops. Sounds like I'm backing out of a corner I put myself in, but that wasn't supposed to sound as serious as it probably did. Was supposed to be more of a reference to current media speculation and pressure. I certainly wouldn't want Mourinho at Anfield - but, that said, I don't mind the guy at all other than the Chelsea connection, compared to someone like Alex Ferguson who I really don't like through and through, not just because of his affiliation.

Seems besides the point of course, I doubt we could afford to sack Rafa any time soon anyway. I'd much rather see Rafa change his tactics and his transfer market luck than I would see Liverpool change Rafa. Neither seem particularly likely right now.

Craig Beevers · Post by **Craig Beevers** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 1:25 pm

Jon O'Neill wrote:
Craig Beevers wrote:The trouble is people are daft enough to absorb this bollocks. It becomes self-reinforcing because there are very few people with a brain involved to form their own opinion and go against the flow (BBC pundits are basically clones but with different aesthetics). Particularly as humans in general are lacking in objectivity. It's not like football has some clear indicators of performance for individuals, unlike say cricket which has lots of very relevant statistics. So when someone says Gerrard has great technical ability you can't just look at some stat which shows 80% of the time his second touch is a tackle (just behind Michael Owen in that regard).
I agree with this. Now, watch a Liverpool game (not an England one, where he is played grossly out of position) and observe Gerrard closely, with no preconceptions. If you can't see how he is a cut above then you're seriously missing something. It's a bit like how the less knowledgeable Liverpool fans say Rooney is shit. The pair of them are outstanding players, and you won't find anyone with a clue about football saying anything to the contrary. Which is why I think you don't have a clue. That and almost every other post in this thread.

A cut above what? The rest of Liverpool's wealth of mediocre no-names? Yes obviously. This stuff about how he's grossly played out of position for England is typical of the bullshit excuses used to defend anything Liverpool. It's the same with the 'injury crisis' which includes of all 2-3 players with a short-term issue. The only viable argument as far as I'm concerned regarding Gerrard and England is the tempo at which they play, which being international football is generally slower and has a greater dependency on consistent technical ability (something which Gerrard doesn't have in general, he's good technically when striking a ball but weak in other areas). If England's side was selected on performance over the past 10 years Gerrard would have a lot less caps. If he was Spanish he would be warming the bench. He's an unremarkable international player, you have to go down to club level before he stands out. Rooney on the other hand when he's not spending the whole game pissing about like he's in a Nike advert or if someone's knocked over his pint, has stood out at international level.