Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

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James Roper
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Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by James Roper »

This may not be worded the best, but here goes:

These days, a lot of the startlingly good contestants that appear on countdown are from apterous. However, every now and again we would get these kind of people in the era before apterous had begun (e.g, Craig Beevers, Paul Gallen etc.). These days, because people tend to find apterous, we don't get this standard from non-apterites nowadays.

So this got me thinking. Since apterous was created, who have been the greatest contestants to participate that aren't members of apterous?

(Excluding some of the contestants from the 30th BC)
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Gavin Chipper »

Did Carl Williams use Apterous? If not, you'd probably have to put him top, given how close he came to winning the series. But he might have gone on under a different name. Cate Henderson's octorun was pretty good, although she lost in the quarters, and Nicki Sellars made the final. I don't think Nicki Sellars was on Apterous, and Cate Henderson apparently hated the concept.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Graeme Cole »

Gavin Chipper wrote:Did Carl Williams use Apterous?
Not that I'm aware, although it was suspected that he might have done. I asked him whether he did and he said he'd heard of apterous but didn't play on it.

There is an apterous profile with his name, but I think that was Ed messing about. :-)
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Innis Carson »

Peter Godwin and Brian Selway both showed glimpses of very strong form, but were plagued by inconsistency which ultimately prevented them from posing any serious threat to the apterites in their series. Carl seems pretty much the clear winner in terms of finals success. It was striking that after Brian in Series 61, there were no non-apterite octochamps at all until Dave Taylor in S65.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Mark Deeks »

No reason to assume Carl was an Apterite. He knew it about it, sure, but since he admitted to Googling at least me, and no doubt all of us in the QF lineup, that's no great mystery. So yeah. Him.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Jordan F »

I think as much as people don't like his practices and the way he did things, I think Jeffrey Hansford, just based on pure ability, is up there. Some stumbling blocks and obviously some buzzing controversy, but as I understand it (and those of you in the know can interject where I can't), there was still quite a bit of skill just in his noggin. Michael Macdonald-Cooper and Tim Reypert I think are underrated too. Probably can't consider them perhaps all time greats because of their QF losses, but they both had some skill (I consider Michael stronger than Tim because Tim appeared relatively weak at the numbers).
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Innis Carson »

On the list of octochamps by number of maxes in the Ask Graeme thread, the winner amongst non-apterite octochamps in the 'apterous era' (which I would define as Series 60 onwards) is actually Shane Roberts, though he's only very narrowly ahead of some others. Obviously there are plenty of people higher up in the list who were at least as 'natural' as him, but it's hard to quantify that.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Jojo Apollo »

The great Julian Fell said he used to practise on the handheld computer game of Countdown.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by James Roper »

Jordan F wrote:I think as much as people don't like his practices and the way he did things, I think Jeffrey Hansford, just based on pure ability, is up there. Some stumbling blocks and obviously some buzzing controversy, but as I understand it (and those of you in the know can interject where I can't), there was still quite a bit of skill just in his noggin. Michael Macdonald-Cooper and Tim Reypert I think are underrated too. Probably can't consider them perhaps all time greats because of their QF losses, but they both had some skill (I consider Michael stronger than Tim because Tim appeared relatively weak at the numbers).
After apterous was created.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Adam Gillard »

Mary Adie did very well.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by LaurenHamer »

As did the lovely Dave 'I wish you were my uncle' Taylor. Aww, lovely Dave. I think he did sign up briefly after his games but never stuck around.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by L'oisleatch McGraw »

MOOOOSE! :mrgreen:
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Essentially all the non-apterites of S77.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Gavin Chipper »

Bradley Cates?
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Gavin Chipper wrote: Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:32 pm Bradley Cates?
Definitely.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Ian Volante »

Tom S wrote: Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:01 pm
Gavin Chipper wrote: Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:32 pm Bradley Cates?
Definitely.
Meh, I beat him, can't be that good.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Ian Volante wrote: Tue Jan 23, 2018 1:33 pm
Tom S wrote: Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:01 pm
Gavin Chipper wrote: Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:32 pm Bradley Cates?
Definitely.
Meh, I beat him, can't be that good.
Hah, albeit about 10 years ago- a rematch would be interesting :) ;)
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Gavin Chipper »

Amey Deshpande?
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Ian Volante »

Tom S wrote: Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:35 pm
Ian Volante wrote: Tue Jan 23, 2018 1:33 pm
Tom S wrote: Mon Jan 22, 2018 11:01 pm

Definitely.
Meh, I beat him, can't be that good.
Hah, albeit about 10 years ago- a rematch would be interesting :) ;)
Aye, might be a little different now...
Gavin Chipper wrote: Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:59 pm Amey Deshpande?
Now he was stunningly good... :cry:
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by sean d »

Bradley did exceptionally well second time round. He went to the semis in the notorious series 69 and was within striking distance of Dylan on the final numbers round, despite never using Apterous
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Chris Thorn.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Elliott Mellor »

Tom S wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:22 pmChris Thorn.
Not sure I fully agree with this, or at least he isn't of the standard of a lot of the people mentioned in this thread.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Elliott Mellor wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:55 am
Tom S wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:22 pmChris Thorn.
Not sure I fully agree with this, or at least he isn't of the standard of a lot of the people mentioned in this thread.
Suppose I am thinking of him in terms of this series, and whilst I agree with the statement aforesaid, I still think he is worthy of a spot on here....
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Zarte Siempre »

Tom S wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:26 am
Elliott Mellor wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:55 am
Tom S wrote: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:22 pmChris Thorn.
Not sure I fully agree with this, or at least he isn't of the standard of a lot of the people mentioned in this thread.
Suppose I am thinking of him in terms of this series, and whilst I agree with the statement aforesaid, I still think he is worthy of a spot on here....
Yeah.. no.

If you included him you basically bring hundreds of other people in. It's not to say he's not good, just that... he's not THAT good. I count 15 non-Apterites who've had around or over his score just in the last 10 series.

The one I'm amazed looking back that no-one has mentioned in this thread was Stephen Briggs. He seems to have become a forgotten man. Or he was using Apterous and I've forgotten, one or the other.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Johnny Canuck »

Zarte Siempre wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:06 am The one I'm amazed looking back that no-one has mentioned in this thread was Stephen Briggs. He seems to have become a forgotten man. Or he was using Apterous and I've forgotten, one or the other.
Totally second this -- in fact, I believe that if you convert Briggs' octototal to a 9-round equivalent, he's on par with Harvey Freeman, and during his own preparation, he may not have used forms of technology much beyond those that Freeman had access to. His series finals performances in particular were superb among those of non-Apterites.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Gavin Chipper »

Zarte Siempre wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:06 am The one I'm amazed looking back that no-one has mentioned in this thread was Stephen Briggs. He seems to have become a forgotten man. Or he was using Apterous and I've forgotten, one or the other.
I don't think he was on Apterous. But also, this thread hasn't been the only discussion of these things, and his name has come up previously in other threads.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Elliott Mellor »

Zarte Siempre wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:06 am
Tom S wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:26 am
Elliott Mellor wrote: Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:55 am

Not sure I fully agree with this, or at least he isn't of the standard of a lot of the people mentioned in this thread.
Suppose I am thinking of him in terms of this series, and whilst I agree with the statement aforesaid, I still think he is worthy of a spot on here....
Yeah.. no.

If you included him you basically bring hundreds of other people in. It's not to say he's not good, just that... he's not THAT good. I count 15 non-Apterites who've had around or over his score just in the last 10 series.

The one I'm amazed looking back that no-one has mentioned in this thread was Stephen Briggs. He seems to have become a forgotten man. Or he was using Apterous and I've forgotten, one or the other.
Yeah exactly my thoughts. Just because someone octoed and is temporarily number 1 seed, albeit in a weak series so far that's no reason for inclusion on this thread. So yeah, scrub that.

Surprised Stephen Briggs hasn't been mentioned too, his octo score was 883 !
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

John Cowen- yes, he was largely inconsistent at times, but had Brad lost his QF, I am sure John would have stormed through to the final and would have produced a very close game against Tom. Who knows what the outcome would have been like?...
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Zarte Siempre »

Tom S wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:28 pm John Cowen- yes, he was largely inconsistent at times, but had Brad lost his QF, I am sure John would have stormed through to the final and would have produced a very close game against Tom. Who knows what the outcome would have been like?...
John's best was as good as anyone. John's worst was... pretty bad tbh. I dunno, I don't totally object to this, but I'm not totally in agreement either.

He is however, a thoroughly lovely bloke. If that was a factor for assessment, it would help him.
Possibly the first contestant to accelerate with a mic clipped...
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Zarte Siempre wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:53 pm
Tom S wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:28 pm John Cowen- yes, he was largely inconsistent at times, but had Brad lost his QF, I am sure John would have stormed through to the final and would have produced a very close game against Tom. Who knows what the outcome would have been like?...
John's best was as good as anyone. John's worst was... pretty bad tbh. I dunno, I don't totally object to this, but I'm not totally in agreement either.

He is however, a thoroughly lovely bloke. If that was a factor for assessment, it would help him.

Do agree with you that he was not as good on some occasions, but his play in the semi was cracking, and he is more worthy than some mentioned above...
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Elliott Mellor »

Zarte Siempre wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:53 pm
Tom S wrote: Wed Feb 21, 2018 1:28 pm John Cowen- yes, he was largely inconsistent at times, but had Brad lost his QF, I am sure John would have stormed through to the final and would have produced a very close game against Tom. Who knows what the outcome would have been like?...
John's best was as good as anyone. John's worst was... pretty bad tbh. I dunno, I don't totally object to this, but I'm not totally in agreement either.

He is however, a thoroughly lovely bloke. If that was a factor for assessment, it would help him.
He certainly showed glimpses of very strong form, but his trouble was he was plagued by inconsistency. Thinking about it though, had he chosen 1l he could have had maybe an 850 octototal, so I think perhaps he's worthy of a mention.

Was a lovely bloke it seemed, too.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Ian Birdman »

I don't think Stephen Briggs used apterous at all so he'd have to get my vote. Incredibly consistent.

Interestingly Stephen plays in the Birmingham chess league that i play in and is good...very darn good!

I think with John C there's a distinction between TALENT and overall game performance. He came out with some lovely spots and some great number solves. Things that most non apterites (and some apterites like me!) simply would not be able to do.

Obviously he was wildly inconsistent so I don't think you could label him the best overall non apterous player. But talent alone? Worth a mention.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

The guy who Zarte played yesterday came up with some lovely, nice letters spots yesterday.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Owen Carroll »

John Cowen wasn't an apterite until after the finals. He wasn't exactly bad to get third place in the whole series.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Honorable mention to Maggie Barlow and Bob Lunt, despite not becoming an octochamp.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Owen Carroll »

Dougie Mackay and phil Davies defo
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Owen Carroll »

And maybe Paul Harper?
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Owen Carroll wrote: Sat May 18, 2019 7:26 pm And maybe Paul Harper?
No. Don't mean to be harsh- nice guy, but doesn't fall into this category imo.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Owen Carroll »

Tom S wrote: Sun May 19, 2019 11:13 am
Owen Carroll wrote: Sat May 18, 2019 7:26 pm And maybe Paul Harper?
No. Don't mean to be harsh- nice guy, but doesn't fall into this category imo.
Ok fair enough. What about the two I mentioned above?
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by L'oisleatch McGraw »

Mark Deeks wrote: Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:48 am No reason to assume Carl was an Apterite. He knew it about it, sure, but since he admitted to Googling at least me, and no doubt all of us in the QF lineup, that's no great mystery. So yeah. Him.
We need more nice people like Carl in the Countdown community. :mrgreen:
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Owen Carroll »

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: Sun May 19, 2019 4:23 pm
Mark Deeks wrote: Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:48 am No reason to assume Carl was an Apterite. He knew it about it, sure, but since he admitted to Googling at least me, and no doubt all of us in the QF lineup, that's no great mystery. So yeah. Him.
We need more nice people like Carl in the Countdown community. :mrgreen:
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by L'oisleatch McGraw »

Yep, "top bloke"
as the Brits or Aussies might say.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Owen Carroll wrote: Sun May 19, 2019 11:51 am
Tom S wrote: Sun May 19, 2019 11:13 am
Owen Carroll wrote: Sat May 18, 2019 7:26 pm And maybe Paul Harper?
No. Don't mean to be harsh- nice guy, but doesn't fall into this category imo.
Ok fair enough. What about the two I mentioned above?
They got to CoC so I don't see why not even the Dougie lost his 8th game.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Mark Deeks »

You're not still bitter about the fact I said your avatar looked like the money shot in robot/human bukkake, are you?
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by L'oisleatch McGraw »

Mark Deeks wrote: Tue May 21, 2019 5:16 pm You're not still bitter about the fact I said your avatar looked like the money shot in robot/human bukkake, are you?
A mention of CW put the notion of "bitterness" into your mind. :oops:
I appreciate the simplicity of that.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Mark Deeks »

OK well I'm not entirely sure you're quoting six year old posts of mine, why the thought "I wonder if I can annoy this man I have barely ever spoken to" was in your head at that moment, but hey, do your thing. I am now going to light myself on fire as that would be a better use of my time.
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by L'oisleatch McGraw »

Sounds promising. Enjoy.
----------------------

Recent nominees for this:-
Jodine Lawrence [S79]
Robin Johnson [S79]
Andrew Jackson [S79]
Maggie Barlow [S80]
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: Wed May 22, 2019 9:39 pm Sounds promising. Enjoy.
----------------------

Recent nominees for this:-
Jodine Lawrence [S79]
Robin Johnson [S79]
Andrew Jackson [S79]
Maggie Barlow [S80]
Jodine showed some promise but does not deserve to be in the same league as others. I would rate Robin more over Andrew despite his debut. Maggie is worthy, even if she gives a bad QF performance....
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Tom S wrote: Fri May 24, 2019 12:02 pm
L'oisleatch McGraw wrote: Wed May 22, 2019 9:39 pm Sounds promising. Enjoy.
----------------------

Recent nominees for this:-
Jodine Lawrence [S79]
Robin Johnson [S79]
Andrew Jackson [S79]
Maggie Barlow [S80]
Jodine showed some promise but does not deserve to be in the same league as others. I would rate Robin more over Andrew despite his debut. Maggie is worthy, even if she gives a bad QF performance....
On reflection, I think I would go as far as saying that she is one of the best, if not the best female Non-Apterite in the post-apterous era...
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Technically, Brendan had a very solid run (which was done on no apto practise), though given that he igned up after his octorun, any performance from then on discounts him. He was very nervy on his QF game, yet still got some good numbers spots though.....
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Re: Talented Non-Apterous Contestants

Post by Tom S »

Paul Nixon should qualify for this on the same basis that Mike Daysley qualified for it....
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