c4countdown

Big news!

LLN
LLN guest LLN
LL origin of words LLNC

overall LLNLLNLLLLNC

Mark Deeks wrote:http://www.apterous.org/chat.php?base=1 ... ir=earlier

The digest of the chat logs is as follows:

Channel 4 have required Countdown to change their part lengths from 16, 10 and 10 minutes to 9, 13 and 13 minutes. This means they have to invent a new format.

The new format contains 10 letters rounds, 4 numbers rounds and a conundrum. It will be: LLN in part 1; LLN, anecdote, LLN in part two; and LL, origins of words, LLNC in part three. Each player picks the same number of each type of round.

This change is effective immediately for all shows yet to be made - I think that means episodes broadcast on and after 18th March. Yes, this means the change happens mid-series, and potentially in the middle of someone's run. Oh well.

Oh, and FLORUITED and EXEUNTED will no longer be accepted.

I hope I haven't stepped on Countdown Team's toes in posting the above - I don't know if they were going to make an announcement on the forum, but seeing as it's already being discussed now I thought I might as well summarise it all in one place to save everyone wading through the logs.

I can see what Channel 4 would do it. With the new start time, it means people flicking over after their previous program finished at 14,57 will see Countdown's on, and maybe watch a bit of it, rather than Countdown's ads syncing up perfectly with it as well. Not a fan of the extra numbers round, though. But needs must I suppose.

I won't watch ever again if this happens.

Oh crap, need to improve my numbers more then! What's this new format going to be called?

I can understand the thought process. With the new timings you can fit three rounds into part one and six into each of the other parts. You could keep the same round order:

LLL LNLLLL NLLLNC

But that looks a bit disorganised and probably doesn't flow well. So let's change the order so the numbers games are at the end of the parts:

LLN LLLLLN LLLLNC

This is better, but while we're tinkering with the format, why not also try to address the anomaly whereby one player gets more numbers picks? That gives you the new format...

LLN LLNLLN LLLLNC

This has the added bonus of breaking up the run of five letters rounds they'd otherwise have, and provides a natural break in the middle of part two to put the guest's anecdote in. So I can fully understand the rationale for doing it this way, but I don't like that a minute has been nicked from the overall programme time to make way, presumably, for more adverts.

I've always fought against this but I knew the day would inevitably come.

Of course, Dale Levell will now be the record holder for some arbitrary obsolete alternative variant, like hyper blind omelette goat 9-rounder. I'm sure 170 would be easily beatable if people actually played that variant.

I must say I'm intrigued. Since numbers games often give people an easy 10 points, I'm betting this change will increase people's average scores.

Assuming this is, in fact, true and not a hoax, what will we call this format (on the wiki)? The 15 Rounder Mark II?

This means there'll be an entirely new record book to write too.

JackHurst wrote:This means there'll be an entirely new record book to write too.

Great stuff, I was bored of not having any all-time records. Now I'll have a two-hour window to set a couple before they all get punted away over the horizon again. Unless Charlie brings in new-15 goatdown , new-15 touchdown etc at three month periods over the next couple of years. Then again, would people just custom format everything? I suspect so.

Ian Volante wrote:

JackHurst wrote:This means there'll be an entirely new record book to write too.

Great stuff, I was bored of not having any all-time records. Now I'll have a two-hour window to set a couple before they all get punted away over the horizon again. Unless Charlie brings in new-15 goatdown , new-15 touchdown etc at three month periods over the next couple of years. Then again, would people just custom format everything? I suspect so.

I was more referring to the show than apterous.

JackHurst wrote:

Ian Volante wrote:

JackHurst wrote:This means there'll be an entirely new record book to write too.

Great stuff, I was bored of not having any all-time records. Now I'll have a two-hour window to set a couple before they all get punted away over the horizon again. Unless Charlie brings in new-15 goatdown , new-15 touchdown etc at three month periods over the next couple of years. Then again, would people just custom format everything? I suspect so.

I was more referring to the show than apterous.

Well that too

I must say I am pleased. It makes sense to have two numbers game per contestant and four in total. I've always said the Mathematical content should be increased.

Last year, I pestered the Countdown team for a special championship in honour of the 30 years of Countdown and they have done so. I'd like to think my asking helped, but who knows and who cares - it's happened and what a great champuionship it has been so far. Lot's of episodes full of funny moments and tense moments alike.

From 2010, I also pestered them to increase the numerical content of the show too and they have. I know it's occured due to Channel 4's decision but still I'm pleased. Back in October, someone posted a request for more numbers games on the Countdown Twitter page and the Countdown Team responded saying "why not" and that they'd probably tweek the format in 2013. The tweets went to Rachel too. I'm sure she was pleased. Four numbers games will increase her role a little and decrease the chances of having an episode of all or nearly all easy numbers games, which doesn't give Rachel much of a challenge, so I'm glad for her. Back in 2010, I contacted Damian about having 4 numbers. He said he would prefer that along with 2 conundrum rounds but the advertising restraints set by C4 made such a format difficult. This new format is almost the same as the one I pitched to Damian at a time when I didn't realise that the show had to be a 16 / 10 / 10 min format. So I'm glad it's changed now. It's good how it's still 15 rounds too.

This may be a dull thing to mention but we have now had at least nine formats in use at some point in the last 30+ years:
3 rounders (LNC) used for the Countdown Masters, from 1989-1990 (my first memory of Countdown)
7 rounders (LLN LLNC) used for Celeb editions, used throughout 1997 and one for the first '8 out of 10 Cats' ep in 2012
9 rounders (LLLN LLLNC) used for the main game for 19 years and the first ever Grand Final
9 rounder (LLNL LNLLC) one off used for the 500th episode in 1987
10 rounder (LLN LN LN LNC) one off for the 2nd '8 out of 10 Cats' special in 2012 (only episode ever with 3 TTT's)
12 rounder (LLLN LLLN LLNC) one off for the 25th anniversary episode in 2007
14 rounders (LLNLLNC LLNLLNC) used for the first 19 years, for all Grand Finals (bar the Series 1 Final)
15 rounders (LLLLN LLLLN LLLNC) used for the main game from 2001 until 2013
15 rounders NEW (LLN LLNLLN LLNC) used from 2013 until many years to come hopefully

I may consider going on the show now, as I'm much much better at the numbers and it's the only show on TV that tests numerical skill in each episode and as a key part of the show. I'm still working on the letters and conundrum games too.

Pleased but worried by this. I'm pleased because I've got my logical hat on, and if C4 wants to increase the amount of commercial time then it presumably means they're having no problems selling the slots - that's got to be reassuring for the long term health of the show. I also think it's a fairer format (wouldn't mind a rule that a player can't pick the same type of numbers round twice in a game, to avoid it getting samey, but that probably causes more problems than it solves).

Worried, on the other hand, because Countdown thrives on being a fixed point in people's day. It desperately needs a settled format and a settled time, and every time it gets buffeted around it'll shake off another few people that then prove hard to win back. C4 seem to be struggling to get their afternoons right at the moment, and I hope they soon find a pattern that they can set in stone for a couple of years.

Nick Deller wrote: C4 seem to be struggling to get their afternoons right at the moment, and I hope they soon find a pattern that they can set in stone for a couple of years.

I don't really understand why all the shite experimental quiz shows that won't last have to be on in Countdown's slot rather than the other way around...
Anyone want to explain that one?

Andy Platt wrote:

Nick Deller wrote: C4 seem to be struggling to get their afternoons right at the moment, and I hope they soon find a pattern that they can set in stone for a couple of years.

I don't really understand why all the shite experimental quiz shows that won't last have to be on in Countdown's slot rather than the other way around...
Anyone want to explain that one?

If we assume that 'Countdown's slot' (assuming that's even a thing any more) is a good time to be on TV, that seems like a pretty sensible time to stick on a quiz show in the hope that it will be successful. (I mean, I'm not sure Channel 4 would commission game shows that they don't expect to last.)

Also, I think the current schedule is actually quite good for Countdown: Face the Clock and Common Denominator strike me as appealing to the same sort of person, so sticking Countdown in the middle of them would (I'd imagine) get them lots of viewers who are only really interested in the two quiz shows either side but just stick around anyway. (This is all complete speculation, of course: I am not secretly a TV producer.)

Andy Platt wrote:

Nick Deller wrote: C4 seem to be struggling to get their afternoons right at the moment, and I hope they soon find a pattern that they can set in stone for a couple of years.

I don't really understand why all the shite experimental quiz shows that won't last have to be on in Countdown's slot rather than the other way around...
Anyone want to explain that one?

Channel 4 do take risks and try experimental programme formats, that's part of what they're for. However, I do hope that when they've finished experimenting with the current crop of game shows they put Countdown back in a good time slot.

I agree. None of the game shows that have been tested out have struck me as being particularly memorable. '1001 Things You Should Know' struck me as being about a bland as a game show could get.

Hopefully Channel 4 will move it back, and not just stick a property show in there instead.

Nick Deller wrote:(wouldn't mind a rule that a player can't pick the same type of numbers round twice in a game, to avoid it getting samey, but that probably causes more problems than it solves).

I'd like to see a rule whereby each numbers round HAS to be different. And then choosing which type of numbers round to go for at certain times could be a new tactical element. It would also encourage people to brush up on their numbers a bit more!

Ryan Taylor wrote:I'd like to see a rule whereby each numbers round HAS to be different. And then choosing which type of numbers round to go for at certain times could be a new tactical element. It would also encourage people to brush up on their numbers a bit more!

Does that extend to the letters too and that there must be at least one round that contains 3 vowels, one that contains 4 vowels and one that contains 5 vowels?

And the conundrums could never be the same either...

If this is true, then may I do a Robbo impression?

Yes?

YAHOO!!!!!!

More numbers games, and is basically a 14-rounder without the conundrum in the middle.